10.9.07

Song of freedom breakdown 2

Beyond action and beyond learning,
one is at ease,



Sticking with the methodology used in directing the first line one should know the answer to the first question:

Who goes beyond?

What goes beyond?

When do we go beyond?

Where is beyond?

How do you go beyond?

Why is beyond a place to be at ease?

The too excellent answer is that one of the Way goes beyond. I think the imperative is that "we" go beyond. We is the whole universe.

The learning and action go beyond as you become your learning and action. If you are able to take a step back you may see this process. I think it is fascinating as I see it occurring in myself and others.

We go beyond when we accept that all answers fall short.

Beyond is something ineffable. It is also right here. An integration of practice and experience that allows us to start genuine practice. I see no beginning or end.

Going beyond is Right Practice. I think that what determining right practice is for any given person can only be done with the application of great faith, and great doubt.

It is a place to be at ease because once you are beyond you have finally given up and there is no more struggle. I have a mental image of drowning I associate with this line. A violent struggle (early learning and action maybe accompanied by some odd sensations, visions, dreams, nightmares) then oblivion (being at ease, accepting what is)

I know that you know all of this already.

I welcome comments, but I may integrate them into the commentary.

I hope that my efforts are helpful in clearing my own delusion as well as that of others.
Jordan


Acknowledgments

17 comments:

gniz said...

Jordan,

Beyond learning and beyond action...
For myself, I feel like one has to fully understand and take apart both learning AND action before "going beyond" becomes possible.
So perhaps, One Of The Way is just such a master--someone who has studied and practiced with enough conviction to not need it anymore...?

gniz said...

BTW, i am not insinuating that I am One Of The Way...
Just theorizing about what that might take.

Yamakoa said...

Jordan,
I would like to thank you for undertaking this project. It is truly a Herculean effort.
This line is truly poetic, beautiful and sounds very mystical ( at least to me). It got me thinking as to what is truly beyond learning and beyond action. Of course I could be a smart ass and say nonaction or nonlearning, but in reality it so appears that while we are alive and inhabiting these bag of bones nothing seems to be beyond action. Even more, while we no longer are alive, our bodies are still interacting with the enviroment and therefore in action. In sitting with this line I believe that we were in action before "we" were "here". "We" are in action while "here", and "we" will be in action long after "we" are gone.
Anyways just my 2 cents.
Thanks

MikeDoe said...

Jordan:

This time I read all the words that you wrote. It's better that way ;-)

Jordan & The Tortoise said...

Aaron,

So perhaps, One Of The Way is just such a master--someone who has studied and practiced with enough conviction to not need it anymore...?

I am going to venture, largely based on what I have read, heard, and seen, that even a master continues to study and practice. In Buddhism, some classic examples would be Buddha sitting after he saw the morning star and declared "I am Awake" and Bohidharma facing a wall for 9 years after going to China.

Recently I have never heard of any of the the So called Masters of today say "OK, I am done now, no more dharma lessons or sitting for me."

As for your non-insinuating, I have a different thought. What if we are all "one of the way?" You, me the guy who gets my trash on wends day mornings, The guy who fired a moarter at the Mess hall when I was eating lunch, everyone and everything along with the void.
Sorry if that sounds Zenny, but that is my theory. of course that dose not mean I would not have killed the guy for interrupting my meal (and trying to kill me and my friends in the process) if I had caught him. But he too was one of the way. Or as my Mom put it "in the way"

Thank you for your comments.


Yamakoa,

I understand what you are saying about it sounding mystical. I am sort of attempting to de-mystify it in my own way for my own small understanding. This is proving to be challenging. Sometimes I don't have the words but just a feeling. I am trying to impart that feeling to the reader. Your comments make me think I may have had some success.

"we were in action before "we" were "here". "We" are in action while "here", and "we" will be in action long after "we" are gone."

Thank you for your learning and action,
Jordan

Jordan & The Tortoise said...

Mikedoe,

Thank you for reading!

From your own blog, I particularly enjoyed this:

This whole post is completely pointless. It's amusing but pointless. This blog is often just playing with snowflakes - they are pretty but melt as soon as you try and hold them. Outside the grass continues to grow. Inside the silence continues to grow.

I think this could be applied to much more than your posts and snowflakes.

Thank you again for blogging,
Jordan

Jordan & The Tortoise said...

Late thought, to Mikedoe, If you get enough snowflakes you can make a snow ball!

Those can be allot of fun!

Take care,
Jordan

MikeDoe said...

Jordan:
Have you ever tried to turn a snowball back into snowflakes?

Jordan & The Tortoise said...

Mikedoe,


It happens naturally, no need to try.

Take care,
Jordan

oxeye said...

I think of going beyond as a continual process (zazen) and not as a destination. but that doesn't explain what "all the way beyond." could mean. I only understand that as an abstraction.

Yamakoa said...

Oxeye,
I found your post very interesting. As I was done reading it, I went to sit down and continue reading the dhammapada. The page where I left off has the "buddha" talking bout his experience with Nirvana and the four (dhyana) stages one goes through. The Fourth stage he describes as going beyond. We may ask, going beyond what? He states, going beyond the duality of pleasure and pain. Going beyond the whole field of memory making forces of the mind. Going beyond the reach of thought. I think to myself, how does one do that and still be alive? The buddha continues only through detachment and contemplation.
Argghhhhh!

MikeDoe said...

I think to myself, how does one do that and still be alive?

If you find out can you let me know? It's a question that I have a keen interest in...

Jordan & The Tortoise said...

Jeff, Yamakoa, Mikedoe,

Thank you for your help

For me, it is important to step back sometimes.

Looking over what I wrote :Going beyond is attainable through Right Practice. I think that what determining right practice is for any given person can only be done with the application of great faith, and great doubt.

I think I made a huge mistake I am removing attainable through

with appologies,
Jordan

oxeye said...

Jordan - You have been a big help to me.. I think that going beyond includes everything that we went beyond too. It isn't like we're going to lose or gain anything. we get to keep all the ignorant crap but we just change our perspective a little. we see some things and we forget some things.. and like you said, this is how things seem to be at any particular point in space and time. that will always change. And I don't think we need to try and remember anything. If things keep returning, we will remember them. If they don't, they were not very important anyway. I liked what you said about right practice for any given person can only be done with the application of great faith, and great doubt. that seems exactly right. thanks

MikeDoe said...

Yamakoa:

I've published what might be a partial answer that I fell over in my blog Perfection of Wisdom

Gregor said...

Going beyond, drowning? Perhaps surrendering of the self, I dunno but it sounds good, lol.

Jordan & The Tortoise said...

Jeff,

Thank you for your encouragement. It really means allot.

Mikedoe,
I really appreciate your work on Dogen Doe.

Greg,
When I am trying to break things down I often find myself trying to paint a picture. The image of drowning has been burnt in my head for a while. The lungs screaming for air, the bodies final thrashing then finally the struggle is over.

I am sure others have and will explain what I am getting at better. But that is what came to mind at the time.

May all be well and happy,
Jordan

Thanks for looking!